Hi Jon,
Thanks for your response.
I understand everyone here puts a lot of efforts in improving the seafood business, its applicable to the World in general, and that's a very good thing, I would love to see that our products we sell to the World has a lot of benefits rather than just brand (packagings) and weight (in can be water, air, residues etc.), Shrimp is a very good source of protein, it's a wonderful seafood, and to be honest in our company point of view, it's a very good business, that's why we put a lot of efforts in improving it, be it in fries technology, feed-technology, Responsible Aquaculture side like antibiotics-free programs, quality controls of production from processing right into marketing and exportation, we integrate the whole operations so we can achieve a sustainability and continuity, we believe that if every steps have been taken, the results are more high quality shrimps being produced and distributed, you might sense like we are ambitious, but that's not illegitimate if we are ambitious because we clearly apprehend that more responsibility we have to carry on our back as the industry leader in Indonesia, there's a lot of matters that need to be improved and constantly updated if we want to be a leader, including concerns towards humanity and the beauty of the seafood itself, it might sounds like a sales pitch but its true: We want to take what nature gives, give back, preserves it and deliver the shrimps for enjoyment of people everywhere in the world, and that's mean business and we are committed into developing it. I will stick in this forum and watch every situation grows, and very nice to know you.
Very best regards,
Donny
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-seafood@ucdavis.edu [mailto:owner-seafood@ucdavis.edu] On Behalf Of jon
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 12:27 PM
To: 'Amilcar Caputo'; jwekell@comcast.net; seafood@ucdavis.edu
Subject: RE: phosphate based for shrimp treatment
Hi Donny,
Yes, this is a wonderful forum that has provided invaluable information to me and many others. You will find here a resource like no other. We care, deeply, about the seafood industry and we despair that some only care about the short term gains to be had. Dr Wekell put it more eloquently and concisely than I ever could. He stated what we are concerned about, and what the honest seafood processors and NFI are fighting for.
I have to say that your original post raised concern. And yes, I felt compelled to try and say what I thought you really meant. While a weak attempt at sarcasm, I think you basically confirmed what I paraphrased your post as. You responded to each and every post without animosity or defensiveness and I think clearly explained your intentions. It speaks to your heart and I believe your genuine quest for knowledge.
I hope that you will understand that our reaction was not a personal attack, but a concern for what was percieved as a possible continuation of the practices we despise. I am prepared to be proud of you, your efforts, and your company. Do us proud, stick around, let us know how you are getting along.
Regards
Jon McGraw
Seattle
Donny Ng <donny.ng@cpp.co.id> wrote:
Dear All,
Thank You for all of your responses. I highly appreciate all of your information on this issue. I guess I might decided not to go on with the topic, there's too many assumptions and speculation as Amilcar mentioned, and its very hard for me to get a potential solution as further revelation on my corporate's information is strictly limited to authorized personnel, I might contact couple of sources for comparison, again. Thank You very much for your support on this topic, if I have a new one, I will post it out, this is a great forum.
Best regards,
Donny
-----Original Message-----
From: Amilcar Caputo [mailto:caput100@chapman.edu]
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 5:03 AM
To: jwekell@comcast.net; Donny Donny; seafood@ucdavis.edu
Subject: RE: phosphate based for shrimp treatment
Hi guys, particularly I think Donny has done nothing but asked an R&D question. Anything that anyone thought beyond that line is just assumption and speculation. Let's not forget that one of the main objectives of this list is to exchange knowledge, and the way we do that is as important as the knowledge itself.
Important,
Amilcar
________________________________
From: owner-seafood@ucdavis.edu [mailto:owner-seafood@ucdavis.edu] On Behalf Of Jack Wekell
Sent: Saturday, January 06, 2007 11:09 AM
To: Donny Donny; seafood@ucdavis.edu
Subject: Re: phosphate based for shrimp treatment
Donny
I think George's point is a valid one because, let us face it, human nature has its potential a greed in the marketplace; this can propel us to use and abuse food additives. If I can add water (which is basically free) to a product and get somewhere from $5 to $20 per pound for it, this is a mighty incentive to perhaps overuse and additive such as the polyphosphates. I had an old college professor who used to say that the aim of the food industry was to "sell 'em water and air"! A bit cynical and an overstatement, yes, but there is a grain of truth here.
Sad to say many food additives (old and new) can provide such an excuse. On the one hand, I am providing a moister product but I am doing so by including extra water. Is my motivation a "better" product, e.g., water added hams, or perhaps to make a few cents more per pound. Of course, one can never know what the real motivation of the processor might be. For the average retail consumer, this extra water is small and perhaps only represents a few cents worth of profit for the processor. The retail consumer, even if he/she knew the facts (the processor is selling me water), might not even care--it is all part of the price for the product. However, this might also be considered something akin to the old butcher putting his thumb on the scale when he was selling you meat. Here we would agree that this is illegal and economic fraud.
Most modern food additives are double edged swords. For example, carbon monoxide, carbon dioxide (used in modified atmospheres), polyphosphates, etc. have properties that can impart useful properties to a finished product. But at the same time, they can also be used to hide or mask abused products that most buyers would reject if the additive were not used. This is precisely why regulatory agencies were created. They at least attempt to level the playing field for both end consumers and among processors.
John C. Wekell, Ph.D.
Donny Donny wrote:
Hi George,
Thanks for your response.
don't prejudice, i mean here is the moisture holding capacity of some chemical which can used other than STPP, earth has produced natural wonder ingredients that we can use for evey human's economic activity, weight pick up here has the meaning of or is an equation of moisture is not going away after we conduct every steps in processing which required the liquid decreased / depleted, like cooking, if the moist or liquid gone, if you are in shrimp processing floor, you can understand, it can affect the quality pretty much it will affect our selling price because everyone is looking for high quality products, if you think every shrimp processing company is the same, they produced same products with same raw materials, then you are wrong, in fact they are all unique, this uniqueness is the plus or can even be the drawback point for a company, but we are going to preserve this uniqueness, by proper research on many aspects, we never take any single tiny action that can harm our reputation as a good and responsible shrimp processor and exporter. Hope this can answer your question of "economic fraud". I certainly knows that, and no, we are not into that, we are the one who like to innovate rather than cheat. Please perceive my posting as an innovation - "To Share Knowledge". Thank You.
Best regards,
Donny
________________________________
From: SnGHoskin@aol.com<mailto:SnGHoskin@aol.com>
Sent: Friday, January 05, 2007 11:43 PM
To: Donny Donny; owner-seafood@ucdavis.edu<mailto:owner-seafood@ucdavis.edu>; seafood@ucdavis.edu<mailto:seafood@ucdavis.edu>
Subject: Re: phosphate based for shrimp treatment
The weight pick-up is not quite satisfying?! Have you heard the term "economic fraud"?
George Hoskin
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