Hi Ron:
You know, I think you're right or darn close to being right. I woke up
early thinking about this and further forays above, beyond, and below
the term lead me to the same conclusion. I don't have Fowler's or the
like and the only Garner we have lists ultra and intra, but no infra, so
couldn't trace it that way. And, the only place I see infra a lot is in
footnotes and in the light bulb section of hardware store, neither of
which is terribly helpful here.
It does seem to be used a bit more in the criminal law context, so I was
thinking there might be some traditional, historical, or British
connection (etymological perhaps), but again, don't have the research
resources here (other than limited online ones, which in this instance
are somewhat inferior).
I approach questions like this from non-attorneys carefully - attorneys
understand ambiguities and terminology that you sometimes have to take
on face value, given its source - and we have a lot of context and
intangible signals that tell us to trust or not trust what we read and
assume. With non-attorneys, you don't always know the whole context,
they certainly don't know how to separate the Weatabix from the Kix, and
I always admire their willingness, not to mention bravery, to try to
understand this tough world of law and legal research. So I sometimes
take it a little further, if only to give me a chance to figure out what
they know, don't know, and need to know. And they do come up with some
stumpers sometimes :-)
Thanks!
Laura
________________________________
From: Ronald Huttner [mailto:rshutt@netspace.net.au]
Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2007 5:18 PM
To: law-lib List; Laura Orr
Subject: Re: Difference between INTRA vires and INFRA vires?
Hi Laura,
I wouldn't devote a further second to this enquiry. It would be
time wasted. "Infra vires" means exactly the same thing as "intra vires"
in the legal context. It is simply a less accurate way of expressing
exactly the same concept - used solely by those whose knowledge of Latin
is definitely infra that of those who use the correct word "intra" !
Ron Huttner LL.B (Hons)
(Retired) Barrister, Solicitor, Law Lecturer and Legal
Researcher
Melbourne
Victoria
Australia
"Cogito Ergo Sum"
On 03/08/2007, at 9:23 AM, Laura Orr wrote:
Greetings:
I have a (non-attorney) patron who wants to know exactly
what INFRA vires means. (We know about ULTRA vires and even INTRA
vires.) I can piece it together (so to speak), but not with sufficient
assurance to withstand sharp and close scrutiny and certainly not to
when it comes to explaining the difference between INTRA and INFRA
vires to a non-attorney. (Those pesky withins and belows get us every
time.)
We're a small library with only a couple of
dictionaries, Black's and one edition of Ballentine, and neither defines
INFRA vires (the one we really want to know about), though the patron
can see each word defined individually. A few Internet search engine
searches help, but something more authoritative is needed.
The context was a page in a book on criminal procedure,
but it's obviously a word used in several contexts, usually having to do
with official conduct. Sooo, if a police officer acts INFRA vires, is
s/he acting within (INTRA) or beneath his/her power (INFRA), or are they
the same thing? And if BELOW, what the devil does that mean if it's
different from ULTRA?
It is possible that in the early morning all will become
clear to me (I'm most definitely a morning person) without assistance,
but for now, I put myself (throw myself? is there a difference? :-) at
your mercy.
Many thanks!!!
Laura
Laura J. Orr
Law Librarian
Washington County Law Library
111 NE Lincoln St
Hillsboro, OR 97124
Phone: 503-846-8870
Fax: 503-846-3515
Email: laura_orr@co.washington.or.us
<mailto:laura_orr@co.washington.or.us>
URL: http://www.co.washington.or.us/lawlibrary
<http://www.co.washington.or.us/lawlibrary>
Blog: oregonlegalresearch.blogspot.com
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